Evolution of suits over the years

[JamesSwim]

How have brief changed over the years? One person in the board said he recognized a speedo style suit from the '80s. I realize fabrics change. What else changed? Have they gotten better, or worse?

[louis]

Well JameSwim, speedos really started in Australia, by a scotish immegrant, (he was gay) the firat speedos wereMAINLY ALL 100% nylon most were 4 inches sides.
Then triough the years the Dupont company came out with spandex lycra materials thus speedos from then on used those materials to fabricate speedos, as from the 80ts they didnt change much except that thay ahave bene made from 4 to 3 and 2 and 1 inches sides, new colors, patterns multocolors and such. Then were added pouches, and back and front seams like the japanese suits and Nikes and outhers .... some are now made with very shiny materials that enhances the suits. see trough and non see trough of course, front and back linings have bene added, mind you 100% nylon still prevails.
Now there is a huge competition between speedo makers and are sold by hundreds of different companys, just navigate trough the internet you will see that there is hundreds of choices of styles , materials, etc, Who sead thet speedos were out of style noticing the hundreds of them offered to detailers and the general public is prouf enough that they are still going on like our moto here on the board SPEEDO ON.... (SORRY FOR MY MISSPELLINGS)

[SwimTeamSpeedo]

Add to this that Speedo is a brand, not a style. Just like Kleenex is a brand, not a type of tissue. When people incorrectly call a swimsuit a speedo, they really mean a brief. There are not hundreds of companies that make speedos, there are lots of companies that make swim briefs.

[sebbie]

Jockey was the first company to come up with brief-style underwear for men, and the design dates from the 1930s. Guys were initially uneasy about the new, then considered very minimal, design, when the normal undewear for men was the so-called "Union suit", much larger, often with a trap door in the rear. As I understand the story, sales were slow initially especially in less urbanized areas , but men found the minimal jockey shorts to be very comfortable and by the 1940s they were widely worn See this link. Go to the 1930s http://www.jockey.com/en-us/CorporateInfo/History/

Anyhow, what the Speedo company did was simply adapt the Jockey Brief design for use as swimwear. Obviously cotton was not going to cut it as swimwear, and thats when the newly developed nylon came into play. Others had experimented with brief-style swimwear prior to Speedo. In the 40s there were actually brief-style swimuits for men made out of WOOL of all things!

The rest is history, mainly the transition to Lycra. In the late 1980s competition swmmers thought the smaller the brief the faster they could swim, so this was the period of time you saw the really tiny briefs, particularly worn by competitive swimmers from Europe...France, Italy, 1/4"-1/2" inch siides. Then the early 90s thongs became popular with many men but that is a story for another day. I remember sorting hrough a rack of thongs for men at Macy's. I used to wear these regularly at Hotel/Motel hot tubs.I would put a swimming brief on over the thong and then discard the brief as I entered the hot tub. Great fun!

Sebbie

[Byron]

As for fabrics we now have fastskin and tan thru (one on sale in forum) just
to mention two - and the new technology for printing on stretch material has of course produced a revolution in pattern and art representations.

As for design , one never seen now is the lace-up at both hips (perhaps from the sixties).
A sexy bikini, mostly pioneered by the French, was joined at the sides by rings, or fixed with interlocking clips. Looked good on the right body but
would need to be searched out from a specialist supplier these days.

As for better or worse, well there are only so many changes possible in a small garment and many have appeared over the years. Today the Brazilian sunga seems to predominate (instead of the trendy tanga of a few years back) but others may disagree.

[louis]

Effectively Byron and Sebby added interesting details to this subject.
SwimteamSpeedo the term speedo is generally used to refer to brief style swimwear,effectively it is a brand, I usually use the term SPEEDO BRAND wene referring speedo made suits and just speedo (s) wene refreeing to swimwear in genaral.

[Byron]

Yes, that's probably been a good way of tackling it and there has also been much past discussion on the speedoboard about a correct singular or plural designation of the garment's by-word.

My own habit has been to use S for the brand and s for all other swim briefs.
I wish in a way that the word had never been adopted at all for general usage but I would think that speedo lovers generally know what they are talking about to each other.

The problems lie with manufacturers and journalists. Just about any type of male swimwear can be found to be described as a speedo. I always was and still am annoyed to see the last James Bond actor being captioned on a pic as wearing a speedo or a tiny speedo. It was neither of course and I had steam coming from my ears when one newspaper even referred to him as wearing a daring bikini ! (in fact Burt Lancaster was more daring in his beach scene with ?.. sixty years ago).

[Torchwatch]

The trouble with men's swim suits is that they are so loosely defined, everyone having different perspectives and definitions.

To me a men's swim suit should be close fitting and exclude swim shorts, board shorts and other loose shorts used for swimming. A proper swim suit should have an elasticated waist and elasticated leg holes.
I would also exclude body suits, skin suits and wet suits as although they are meant to be used for swimming they have functions other than body cover and support built into them, eg warmth, flotation and faster movement through water.
A swim suit should have a back however brief, so I would exclude G strings and jock straps but include swim thongs.
A bikini has a fuller back than a thong but narrow sides (hips) ranging from half inch to 2 inch.
The speedo or swim brief or racing brief has sides ranging from 2 -5 inches, but has a distinct cut away leg look.
Square cuts (sangas in Brazil) lack the cut away look having full sides, resembling tight shorts, while jammers are up to knee length suits derived from cycle shorts.

Very tight brief suits and suits designed for fashion rather than speed may have a pouch front, there seems to be a fashion for pouch fronts at the moment particularly in Brazil.

Suits designed for diving, either from boards or blocks tend to have waist cords to avoid embarrassment when entering the water head first.

Many materials have been used for swim suits cotton canvas and knitted wool were early efforts. Wool is reputed to be very scratchy when dry and endlessly saggy when wet. Speedo pioneered the use of "parachute" nylon, it worked as it doesn't absorb water and just clung neatly to the body when wet. Nylon got replaced by Lycra which made suits truly skin tight although Aussibum have brought nylon back.

Seeing a picture of a suit we can spot the branding, the material and the cut and make a guess at the era and continent the suit comes from or from which the retro design is taken.

[Swimmboy]

I don't think there are any suits designed for diving - I think divers just tend to 'downsive' their Speedos or TYRs or whatever brand of brief suit the other guys on their swim team wear.

[Byron]

Yes, it is a little misleading to suggest that there are special suits designed for
"diving" , be it from platform or block - and waist cords appear in all competition suits for obvious reasons, including those worn by backstrokers who do not commence with a dive.

(but I have yet to see any competitive swimmer enter the water by the pool ladder anyway).

Nevertheless, Torchwatch gives us a very good summary and a reminder of how many styles have appeared on the market over the years and just how confusing it is to put an accurate name to each.
(I wish he hadn't mentioned wool - my mind goes back to early teens and recalls just how horrible it was to be wearing such inappropriate material !)

[Crail]

Byron. Wool ??? Gag me with a spoon !!! Unfortunately, I can relate. Long story; so I'll leave it at that

[SpeedoKid]

We're forgetting about "Ocean"!! They had "racing" suits well before Speedos started to be imported from Australia. Ocean "Champion" - a 7 or 8 inch side cut which was well over twice as much fabric as in the modern "Speedo".

And, yes, before that there were those horrible, itchy, heavy, water-logged wool suits which tended to drag you to the bottom of the pool.

Does anyone remember silk racing suits? I'm told that they existed before WW II. At that point all silk went into the war effort - parachutes.

If memory serves, Speedos were first imported into the US following the 1960 Olympic Games, I bought my first one in the summer of 1963 - a solid maroon nylon suit with ~7" sides.

[Byron]

:eek: I don't remember any silk racers but seem to have a fellow sufferer in Crail as regards woollen trunks.

Just to compare, here are swimming shorts in Dubai 2011 and in Hawaii 1953 (Deborah Kerr being the actress I could not recall in the famous wet clinch with Burt Lancaster - From Here To Eternity).

http://www.thenigeriandaily.com/2011/06/27/billy-faiers-recreates-romantic-beach-scene-with-her-boyfriend-in-tiny-orange-bikini/

(Bring back Burt I say - he also made The Swimmer in 1968 of course)

[Byron]

:o http://www.thenigeriandaily.com/2011/06/27/billie-faiers-recreates-romantic-beach-scene-with-her-boyfriend-in-tiny orange-bikini/

[Torchwatch]

Any suit with a waist cord is designed for diving, whether you are diving from the side of the pool or from the high boards if your suit isn't totally secure it will end up around your ankles.
Suits not intended for such use may not have waist cords.

Isn't it annoying when the end of the string gets lost inside the suit.

[dorcas3]

The best way to fix a lost end is to pull the whole cord out-Pin on a small safety pin-reensert and work it back through-be surprised how fast that works.

[Byron]

:mad: Yes, and why are some suit manufacturers so mean with the length supplied? - does it mean a cent difference in profit for them ?

[Byron]

OK - hope this lot works:

Casino Royale:
The "daring pic" that launched a thousand newspaper articles in 2006
(007 Daniel Craig)

http://www.paulinlondon.com/2006/11/news-bond-premiere.html


A potted history of swimsuit styles:

http://elupton.com/2009/10/swim-suits-stats/

Note that the US swimmers of 1948 are "streamlined"
(if that was at the Olympic Pool that would be the last
occasion the Games were hosted in London).

[Byron]

Silk suits:

Cannot find one but did see that they were at one time
standard issue to US Marines.

Ocean:
The company appears to have started in New York although
no history found.

Pic 5 here seems to be an Ocean Champion with a yellow side stripe
(and a club or brand logo hard to discern)

http://meninnylon.blogspot.com/2011/09/01_archive.html?zx=dd8f0e31b3b5ccda


Also

http://www.hydroponicsonline.com/store/5os-vtg-NOS-Ocean-trunks-nylon-surfer-lifeguard-speedo-XL_130647382136.html

and

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-Ocean-Champion-Mens-Swimsuit-/220871575592

[Byron]

Silk suits:

Cannot find one but did see that they were at one time
standard issue to US Marines.

Ocean:
The company appears to have started in New York although
no history found.

Pic 5 here seems to be an Ocean Champion with a yellow side stripe
(and a club or brand logo hard to discern)

http://meninnylon.blogspot.com/2011/09/01_archive.html?zx=dd8f0e31b3b5ccda


Also

http://www.hydroponicsonline.com/store/5os-vtg-NOS-Ocean-trunks-nylon-surfer-lifeguard-speedo-XL_130647382136.html

and

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-Ocean-Champion-Mens-Swimsuit-/220871575592

[Byron]

:o first of three URLs above is wrong and should be
http://meninnylon.blogspot.com/2011_09_01_archive.html

Ocean Champion there is pic 5 of 45 and I think the guy is
wearing a SLSC emblem on his suit. (for the City of S........)

I said no silk suits to be found but there are all sorts of stuff
on this blog and a couple are in fact included.

[Byron]

found one (4th pic down) (Ipanema Brazil)
http://www.aussiegayguy.com/speeedo/tag/red-speedos/page/2/

[Byron]

correction: http://www.aussiegayguy.com/speedo/tag/red-speedos/page/2/

[JamesSwim]

http://www.powerhousemuseum.com/collection/database/collection=Speedo_Swimwear

Has a collection of swimwear going back many years.

[Byron]

Thanks James - long time no see and they seem to have a lot more cataloged in detail now.
We hadn't mentioned "paper" suits previously for the various fabrics and they are there for Seoul 1988 (and some board memberrs still have some).

[JamesSwim]

I remember from long ago a brief with stretch that was not made with Lycra.
I think it a Jantzen suit and was woven with nylon and some latex rubber -- kind of like an Ace ankle brace supporter.

[Byron]

:) Remember it just as you describe. A great fit and I had it in light blue. Never did know what to call that fabric but did not as I recall appear in any other than Jantzen suits. All I remember was a slight dimpled or honeycomb surface - not silky or shiny.

[JamesSwim]

Yes, mine was navy blue. It was cut with a front center seam, and the fit was good. It didn't stretch as much as like Lycra, and that made for a snug, different kind fit from suits you find today.

I don't think Jantzen sells men's suits anymore in the US, and I see some in eBay sold from Asia, but I think they just use or license the name.

[dorcas3]

I had a Catalina suit with side split going to nearly the waist. Yellow with blue trim. When sunning you could fold the sides back revealing a very skimpy liner.

[Brent]

Interesting thread. I swam competitively in the 90's, The common view back then was the smaller and tighter the speedo the better. For competition we had special racing suits. We wore them 1 size smaller than normal. This was to maximize the compression. It was more contoured and smaller on the sides than the regular speedo, very tight, and difficult to put on and take off. It didn't reach up all the way to cover my butt, and was unlined except for a thin layer of the same material up front. Visible penis (and balls) lines were the rule. We had to shave everywhere on our bodies, and i do mean everywhere. My obsession with swimming faster over-rode any modesty or embarrassment I felt. We switched to Speedo Aquablades around 1997, tight, striped, still worn a size too small, and semi-transparent. Supposedly it channeled water around the suit. I believe that the technology behind it led to idea that fabric could be less resistant than skin and therefore the larger suits evolved.

[Torchwatch]

At any time where performance takes priority over modesty then sportswear becomes briefer and/or tighter. When modesty takes over due to child protection, homophobic or religious issues sportswear becomes longer, baggier and looks more frumpy.
Performance demands that a swimmer in a tight brief suit shaves.
When materials that perform better than naked shaved skin are permitted than sportwear design can go anywhere, and resulted in bodysuits for swimmers.
Big baggy shorts accepted by prudes and frumps are great for sports fans, they can look sporty wearing the same gear as their heroes whilst tanking up on 10 pints of beer in a bar.

[Byron]

:) Very true - I enjoyed the last line (the old adage of no pain no gain still applies in sport).

I particularly enjoyed hearing also from Brent as a competitive swimmer - we need more pieces like that.
(I hope Louis is taking note as he has been complaining about off-topic posts)

[Byron]

PS to Brent: Did I correctly recognise Oasis as the shoot location?
(your post 6th Jan. and mine 7th)

[PSDave]

When the 100% nylon suits were worn for competitive swimming there was a different suit made for diving. It was made out of something similar to spandex and was very high over the waist. (usually about 8" sides) It fit very tight and didn't offer water resistance when entering the water. The nylon suits fit much lower and briefer. Though worn tight, the nylon and lower fit offered more chance of a Wardrobe Malfunction when entering the water on a dive. When the nylon/lycra blend was perfected more the suits became interchangeable.

[Byron]

I did not know that but it raises a puzzle I have never resolved, ie when the (banned) full-leg suits were around why were they always cut so low
across the hips ?

[Brent]

Examples of the Aquablade fit.

[Byron]

OK - I recognise the Aquablade brief but what I call the leg suits were waist to ankle but cut so low as to barely cover the pubes.
My thought was always that at that part of the anatomy there would not be the closest of fits and so allow undesirable water drag (an important factor if races are won by a hundredth of a second these days).

Btw was it at Oasis ? (the pics you posted three months ago)

[Byron]

Example: http://www.flickr.com/photos/26165382@N06/3296840587/sizes/z/in/photostream/

[Lap Counter]

(referencing Byron's picture)

So, somehow chest hair drag went away when swimmers wore suits that covered the legs?

[NakedBudd]

As for design , one never seen now is the lace-up at both hips (perhaps from the sixties).

A sexy bikini, mostly pioneered by the French, was joined at the sides by rings, or fixed with interlocking clips. Looked good on the right body but
would need to be searched out from a specialist supplier these days.

I remember "Parr of Arizona" had one made from chamois, with D-rings on the sides, and a little chamois pouch for your keys. HOT HOT HOT

[Lap Counter]

I swam competitively in the 90's, The common view back then was the smaller and tighter the speedo the better.

My obsession with swimming faster over-rode any modesty or embarrassment I felt.

During the 1996 Olympics in Atlanta, Speedo plastered the city with bus stop posters of a U.S. team swimmer (I think it was Gary Hall Jr). He was wearing the smallest, tightest suit I'd ever seen. Suit top just barely high enough to cover penis base. Zero hair. Talk about over riding modesty and embarrassment! Wearing that suit would take balls, (but there would be no place to put them). Sticking your pic all over the city would take big brass ones.

It made the suit worn in the famous Mark Spitz poster look huge.

Brent - did those '90s suits stretch to accommodate you, or did the downsized compression just crush your balls? Did you learn any special tricks of how to place your goodies for comfort or look? Wondering, because the Speedo poster showed no hint of any detail. Might have been suit compression, or they might have air-brushed the detail out to make it acceptable for public viewing on a bus poster.

[dorcas3]

I always trained in a drag type suit and then competed in a size or two smaller-this was commom practice on most levels of swimming. It seems to me that the whole speedo issue has appeared in the last 10 or 15 years. In other words progress went backwords. Even the boxer types of trunks were much more form fitting and in fact I had some that you zipped your way into- I even had a racer which had string side panels-only comment "that looks great-where did you get them" Same thing with basketball shorts-they were! and no one gave it a thought-guys used to sit down for coach instructions and show some jock so what everyone including the girls knew us guys were wearing them and so they had haltes for their boobs! Later on jogging bra prototypes were based on two jocks sewed together right here in Burlington, Vermont!.

[Byron]

A reminder:
http://morristsai.com/assets_c/2008/08/t1_spitz-thumb-300x392.jpg

[dorcas3]

Speedo later came out with a much briefer version of the Spitz suit-I had one and remember that it was entirely lined-great colors until they began to fade.

[Byron]

:( ............and yet they know nothing when I say "your posters all around Atlanta in 1966"

[Byron]

1996 for the Olympic Games

[JamesSwim]

As for design , one never seen now is the lace-up at both hips (perhaps from the sixties).

A sexy bikini, mostly pioneered by the French, was joined at the sides by rings, or fixed with interlocking clips. Looked good on the right body but
would need to be searched out from a specialist supplier these days.

I remember "Parr of Arizona" had one made from chamois, with D-rings on the sides, and a little chamois pouch for your keys. HOT HOT HOT

Is this an example of a lace-up at hips? This page has an old ad from the early 1950's.

http://madmen.wikia.com/wiki/Jantzen_Swimwear

[Lap Counter]

Is this an example of a lace-up at hips? This page has an old ad from the early 1950's.

http://madmen.wikia.com/wiki/Jantzen_Swimwear

Interesting to note that Jantzen was a mainstream department store brand, so that suit represents what was popular and accepted in those days. Pretty bold to leave totally bare sides! However, I've got to guess that not too many guys smoked pipes at the beach.

[Torchwatch]

Byron, 1966 was the year of "They think it's all over, it is now!"

The string sided suits came from an era before stretch fabrics, the suit could be made body tight by adjusting the strings.

I remember seeing them in the 1960's in the old Victorian municipal pool. They kind of caught the eye.

Putting eyelets into Lycra is very difficult as the fabric is so thin and stretchy. I've tried it.

We do seem to keep coming back to Jantzen on this board, they must have been an important part of life in the USA.

[Byron]

A bit of clarification needed here:


What you have posted as a quote from NakedBudd is largely my post of 03-11-2012 and his post of 04-25-2012 quotes part of that and adds his own recollection of the Parr suit in chamois with D rings (and yes, I can just about remember that one too now that he mentions it).

Now to side lace-ups (for want of a better description):

The Jantzen guy in red (and hilariously smoking a pipe as pointed out by LapCounter) is in my opinion a figment of some artist's imagination as,
to my knowledge, Jantzen never produced a suit with such lattice-work fabric at the hips (and such an odd design would be out of keeping with their generally good taste).

Lace-up sides certainly existed in some swimsuit designs , for pulling the suit to fit - as an alternative to what we all know as the drawstring waist cord. They never looked very stylish however which no doubt accounted for their short life in the stores. I will post a pic if I can find one but all signs seem to be that they went the way of the dinosaur.

[Byron]

Ah, I now see a fellow recollector (is there such a word?) in Torchwatch.
He is right because I once wore one in that period and as it happens in an old Victorian pool too.
Yes, no good trying to put eyelets into Lycra - it had to be a non-stretch material (which was a sort of satin cotton)
- and that's why I soon hated the awful fit.

I now have to ask him the name of the BBC commentator who uttered
the immortal words of the World Cup victory (was it Kenneth Wolstenholme ?)

[Byron]

Might it be true to say that the USA's Jantzen held (and may still hold) the esteem of
Oz's Speedo?
(as I recall it was generally regarded as a quality product but family finances
inevitably demanded a cheaper purchase for the kids' swimsuits).

[Lap Counter]

Prior to the invention of Lycra, tight fitting swim suits depended on rubberized fabrics to achieve stretch. Although they look quaint and unfashionable now, Elvis's swimsuit was typical for the time.

As a kid I remember seeing a boy my age at the beach wearing a suit with no sides, similar to that Jantzen ad with the pipe (the boy wasn't smoking one, however). I thought he was incredibly bold.

One summer I had a Jantzen suit that was visually and functional identical to a nylon Speedo.

[JamesSwim]

When were briefs popular outside of competition or lap-swimmers?

Looking at this archive of Jantzen ads in this web site, it seems that 1970's or 1980's had most ads for briefs for mainstream (probably stuff you buy in department stores), plus there's an ad describing Lycra

http://www.advertisingarchives.co.uk/index.php?service=search&action=do_quick_search&language=en&q=jantzen

[Byron]

Some good pics there - and I would even go back a little
earlier with dates.

It was possible to find what Brazilians would call tangas in conservative "gentlemen's outfitters" - such daring beach
and swim briefs* would not be seen there today.

Fast-moving fabric techonology had its influence on styles
and colors of course and speedos were only part of a new
fashion trend that encouraged the wearing as leisurewear
of athletic clothing only previously attributable to a particular
sport (just see the profitable paraphenalia for sale in soccer
club shops).

Winston Churchill's romper suit of WWII became the new and
(sometimes horribly) colored shell suit or track suit to be worn
to the shopping mall for example.

* terminology has changed - to say swimbriefs meant precisely
that and was an alternative to "swimming trunks".
I have learned from much earlier confused searching on the internet
however that briefs in the USA means underpants (but, just to make
things even more confusing, trousers are pants).

[bostonspdo]

Old geezer that I am, I not only remember Parr bikinis but I still have a yellow nylon (not chamois) Parr side snap bikini. It's still such a sexy suit that I can't throw it away even though it is not really wearable anymore because all of the leg and waist elastic is shot. And, yes, after all these years it still fits me!

I remember seeing an article in Life magazine about men's open sided swim suits when I was very young (but not too young to pay close attention to the illustrations). I remember that the article, which also had a very brief women's suit, was the occasion of a fire-and-brimstone sermon from our priest about modern day immorality and lack of modesty.

[Torchwatch]

In the 1950's smoking a pipe was considered a very normal, conventional thing to to do. Having a pipe and slippers suggested that you had a home, a wife, a dog and a couple of children. Jantzen has taken Mr Conventional and allowed him and his family a holiday/vacation, he is relaxing in the sunshine with his pipe and his wife. He may be wearing rather daring side-less swimming trunks but because he is such a conventional and conforming person his wearing them is just fashion and in no way sexually explicit or inappropriate.

In the 1970's and 80's swimming briefs were just what you chose to swim in, you could choose colours and patterns to suit your mood. Although pipes had gone out of fashion anyone, any age could wear Speedos. Then somehow the male body became sexually explicit, and wearing brief, tight swim suits in public was thought inappropriate and the conformists covered up.

Wearing brief swimwear on the beach is sensuous and exciting, at their peak Janzten made it seem conventional and almost boring, and as they got the conformists on their side they made money while the celibate priests raged and fumed.

[louis]

Effectively Jantzen and Catalina suits were very popular (end of the fifties, early sixties) were very popular in the USA they were even the favorites of Hollywood mouvie stars, however they were mostly more the 3 inches sides, however at the end of the sixties some 3 inches sides did appear, I dont know why but Jantzen quit making mens suits and kept on making women suits as till this day, as for Catalina suits they simply quit making them.
An old friend of mine who now passed away gave me one , it was a maroon color 4 inches sides with a satin bright like material.

They were consedered as very skimy and sexy suits at the time no wonder they were favorites for mouvie stars.

Yes Parr of Arizona did offer a side lace up suit If my memory is correct (NOT SURE) the fabrick was a kind of light brown or golden color.

Speaking of a lace up chamois suit I have seen one advertized on the net not so long ago, but unfortunetely I cant locate the site, (Or the firm that sold it) To bad I desperately want one for myself, can anyone remember the site or firm.

[Byron]

LOL - in the amusing bit of photoshopping for Elvis in Blue Hawaii* the studio seems to have taken his suit's waistband almost up to his armpits!

Compare: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQxqZ8SVWwI&feature=related
(why the swimfins I don't know)

Here we seem to have our Jantzen pipe-man in close up:
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-jGgpdfKW8XQ/TYKCl_l0w2I/AAAAAAAACDo/1GcJjUedrkw/Jantzen+trunks.jpg



*have to confess only time I have walked out of a cinema in a movie - couldn't take any more of such an awful script and acting

[Byron]

You started something of interest on speedo history here on 11th March James -
you've already had 58 posts and 1740 viewings.

[Torchwatch]

Interesting to see that close up of the pipe smoker suit Byron.
The sides are made by sewing in tapes of the same fabric as the suit, so avoiding the use of eyelets.
I have tried to use eyelets with poor results, the suit edge up scratchy.
possible even to put a wait cord through the top tape.

[dorcas3]

I had one of those open X suits-intersting tan pattern! Also one were it was actual lacing on each side-were not that comfortable. I remember a guy who cut out panels and then punched holes and tied the sides to gather with string-could also use rawhide-more like Tarzan.

[Byron]

OK, I give in and Peter Hurley was not making it up if suits with the lattice sides really existed (though he's probably dead by now and I cannot ask him and I would have preferred to see some proper Jantzen photos to confirm that design was in production at the time).

As I live and learn I also picked up this:
I still cannot find the swimsuit with lace-ups on BOTH sides but it seems there was one (blue here) from the 1940s which so performed on just ONE
side.
Never seen that before but it apparently comes from Allen-A Lifeguard (yes,
that is what it says) and has just been sold (22nd April) by Etsy (which seems to be a sort of Ebay from Leesburg VA).

See if this works: http://img3.etsystatic.com/il_fullxfull.314628295.jpg


PS: I thought KW died about a year ago - it was in fact 2002

[dorcas3]

Some of the outlet stores had all sorts of suit styles. They were not usually of good quality and many times were "no name" Also Parr of Arizona had suits when I was in the Army-wore them at the O Club pool-no problem. One was blue nylon with white piping all around including the leg notch. You had to wear a jock as there was no liner. They were short short and the straps were apparent unless you pulled them into your crack.May a thong would have be less obvious. It was a sharp looking suit. Parr also made zip side trunks which really conformed to your butt and package. Parr is not making much in that line today-seems to have very risque stuff which dont't appeal to me-after all there are limits of decency in public.

[louis]

Yep etsy is effectively a ebay style including sellers of VINTAGE CLOTHING.

[Byron]

Don't know the brand but lace-up at front here contributes to a rather
messy design overall, don't you think?

http://speedomusings.blogspot.co.uk/2012/01/markus-ricci.html

[Lap Counter]

Looks like he's packing a football.

[Byron]

LOL - didn't realise we've seen him before (Joe Sneider)

http://i2.listal.com/image/3127842/600full-markus-ricci.jpg

(not much room for a football there)

[Torchwatch]

Jantzen were an up market swimwear manufacturer, they charged a premium for their suits and were able to use better fabrics and spent more time in making them.
The pipe smoker suit of 1952 has lattice sides, the objective was to make a skin tight suit with non stretch fabrics. I suspect that there is elastic hidden in each of the straps of the lattice, the waist and leg straps hold the suit on while the lattice straps running at different angles tighten the fabric up making the whole suit more skin tight.
It is interesting to note that although at first glance the suit appears to be square cut they are in fact very high waisted briefs. This would hold your belly in and make a man appear slimmer and more muscular. Since this was before the invention of the teenager when everyone wanted to look like their parents this style would appear to be a good thing.
There have been 89 movies with Tarzan in the title between 1918 and 2008, many with Olympic swimmer Johnny Weissmuller in between 1932 and 1948, men in 1952 would have been familiar with Tarzan's open loincloth look and so wished to emulate it, perhaps with a more civilised Jantzen swim suit.

According to David Wallechinsky's Complete Book of the Olympics, while playing in a celebrity golf tournament in Cuba in 1958, Weissmuller's golf cart was suddenly captured by rebel soldiers. Weissmuller sized up the situation, got out of the cart and gave his trademark Tarzan yell. The shocked rebels soon began to jump up and down, calling "Tarzan! Welcome to Cuba!" Johnny and his companions were not only not kidnapped, but were given a rebel escort to the golf course.

[Byron]

Good Tarzan story (and that is what Parr would have been trying to emulate with its chamois bikini would it not ?)

Do we have any evidence of support for JW under the loincloth?
(the fitting at the hip is so tiny and there is no string give-away
if so).

[Byron]

A bit of retro (but not functional) design from a Cheshire company, using Italian fabric:

http://clothestopose.co.uk/mens-swim-trunks---orange-lattice-403-p.asp

[Byron]

First time (for me) to see the Team GB suit by Adidas:

http://wiggle.co.uk/adidas-london-2012-team-gb-swimming-trunk/

[Lap Counter]

First time (for me) to see the Team GB suit by Adidas:

http://wiggle.co.uk/adidas-london-2012-team-gb-swimming-trunk/

Great looking suit! Is it too late to change my citizenship? I've got to get one of those.

(sorry, can't resist: Byron, you are to be congratulated - 2 links in a row that actually work??!!! OMG)

[Byron]

:) .......... must be the tuition I get !

You don't need a new passport - Wiggle say it's 25.67 for USD
(and they do say "replica" of course).


Note for Torchwatch:
Not just in Cuba : the helrwee tribe of African pygmies unfortunately live in a region of very tall grassland. They jump up and down all day shouting
"Where the Hell are we?"

[louis]

Byron, yes indeed Il be darn, nice suit indeed but I dont like the red upper strip, but the logos are nice.
To bad Wiggle does not have a replica of the Biejing suit Tom Daley wore, the blue one with the Adidas logo and the british flag logo, I try d to find one of those for weeks but no go.
Two of them were offered on ebay the first one was sz 30 at $100.00 US , an the second one at $300,00 still sz 30.
I wanted that suit so bad that I am still looking for one.
If Wiggle has a replica of the london olympic suit I wonder if they also had a replica of the Beijing suit.
I wonder waht Tom Daley looks like with the London olympic suit on.

[Byron]

I will ask Wiggle for the blue Adidas but you can imagine the reply.

He's hanging in Madame Tussaud's now but wrong suit so no use me lurking there late at night to get it for you.

http://digitalspy.co.uk/showbiz/news/a368130/tom-daley-honoured-by-amazing-madame-tussauds-waxwork-pictures.html


Seems you're not the only one but guys on this forum sure seem to be getting their trunks in a twist as to what's required:

http://www.spandex-party.com/YAF/default.aspx?g=posts&t=501

[Byron]

Nothing on him so far for 2012 it seems but he has passed his driving test:

http://www.nbcolympics.com/mm/photo/sport/general/39/56/78/395678_m21.jpg

Btw did you notice that spandex party members have rankings of
Newbie, Member, Advanced (and a box each for medals which I
don't understand but would fit my Admiral well)

[louis]

I have that black Adidas suit with white side strips.
And i saw those pics in wax and his car on one of his bolgs.

[Torchwatch]

The new Great Britain team suit reminds me of the USPS colours that Lance Armstrong wore in the Tour de France.

http://www.cyclingdeal.com/04-us-postal-usps-team-cycling-jersey-and-shorts-kits.html

[Byron]

:) ......which also reminds me that I never got a reply from UPS re.
new brown speedos for the couriers to wear, so I guess we can take
that as a hoax.

[Byron]

Can't believe it's more than two months now since James posted this thread but
here's another speedo (from what year I don't know) incorporating a bit of front lace-up this time:

http://surf-surfer.tumblr.com/post/20714386980/ryanlewis

[Byron]

.......which isn't a lace-up:

http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m36gqoDRGA1r61sjro1_1280.jpg.

Green speedo here seems to be rather pointless.

[Crail]

Byron, thanks for posting the URL. Unfortunately, does not work for me. :confused:

[Byron]

...I'm embarrassed again. I see it's wrong but I haven't
so far retraced the damned thing for correction (but I'm
still looking)

[Byron]

:( http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m0ek8g7Nny1qgruyto1_1280.jpg

Here's a designer fooling around and desperate to do something different.
He puts leather at the left hip in a X formation which will never work and the fabric will remain with a kink as he's defying the law of natural horizontal tension.
(the old Jantzen may have had a side lattice but it was not without upper and lower horizontal fabric links also).

[CalifFitnessSwimmer]

I understand the criticisms of the design but it's still an ultra hot model wearing something that looks like it was custom designed just for him.

[Byron]

.....not a mass production model and a guy built like that could wear almost anything.
I just wish some of the guys who come up with these ideas would remember the minimalist architect Mies van der Rohe, "less is more".

[Torchwatch]

To make that suit work properly it would be necessary to stiffen the seams at the edges of the cut away section. A piece of Mechano at each end of the X would keep the upper and lower O rings separate and so keep the suit smooth.
If I were to redesign the suit's fittings I would have the O rings attached to the stiffening piece as one component, something looking like a flat horse bit.
Doing this would keep the suit fabric smooth and make the cross even more dramatic yet not be too difficult to sew in.

[Byron]

........and reminds me of my pet hate, the D ring.
How neat they look as new on the shelf in the shop as they link a carrying
strap (usually leather) to a woman's handbag or other apparel or equipment.
How ugly they then look after a bit of day-to-day use and have moved out of alignment.
PS: hope we're not talking metal meccano if other than dry posing is intended for that suit.

[Torchwatch]

Yes Byron Mechano did tend to rust once the paint was scratched, and no one would want rust stains on their swimwear.
The D rings you refer to would be cheap mild steel dipped in silver paint, as the paint scratches and chips they tend to look tatty. I would prefer stainless steel metal fitting, maybe not so bright at first but would retain their looks.
Real gold or silver fittings on your swimwear might look bling but could weigh you down.
Bronze or brass fittings might react with seawater and go green.

[Byron]

LOL - reminds me I once wore a "waterproof" wristwatch whilst sea swimming.
A bit of a misdescription if ever there was one and day by day thereafter the trapped
water under the face grew more and more algae so that I had a green timepiece with nothing visible any more.

[gaysome]

Back in 1956 I wore a very tiny brief made from shiny satin with laces that tied at the hip,was I pleased with those after my mum bought me the maroon woollen ones with a white belt. when you managed to get out of the water the crutch was down around your ankles.
Why there was a pocket on them escapes me at 12years of age I did`t have a car.
Anyway, my mum bought these tiny little tie-sides from woolworth`s,and I loved them,I felt quite daring as theyed showed "a bit more" of you.
does anyone else remember those? all the boys wore them back then.
keep well
gaysome

[louis]

Thjey kind of ring a bell it would be nice to see pics of them but is unlikely unfortunetely.

[nkdnick]

Oh i can remember going to the beach with my Dad we both had those horrible wool maroon suits was like a heavy shapeless brief ,that was 1965 then school and school green speedo suit was was so hot,then 18 and smallest bikini i could find



Back in 1956 I wore a very tiny brief made from shiny satin with laces that tied at the hip,was I pleased with those after my mum bought me the maroon woollen ones with a white belt. when you managed to get out of the water the crutch was down around your ankles.
Why there was a pocket on them escapes me at 12years of age I did`t have a car.
Anyway, my mum bought these tiny little tie-sides from woolworth`s,and I loved them,I felt quite daring as theyed showed "a bit more" of you.
does anyone else remember those? all the boys wore them back then.
keep well
gaysome

[Byron]

Yes - remember exactly all as stated by Gaysome
(this thread started long ago and I am reminded
even by now no pics. have unfortunately shown up
for suits referred to in many posts)